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New Lightning (Lace Up In Back) Seat Mesh - Anyone Tried It?The one thing I do not like about my P-38/F-40 is the repeated need to re-tension the seat mesh by tightening the cord that goes through the gromments on the seat sides. I realize that the Phantom now comes with a new, lace-up-in-back seat mesh that should take care of the problem, and since the Phantom seat is similar to the P-38 seat, the new design mesh should work on the P-38. The question is, does anyone out there have a P-39 (or Phantom) with the new design seat mesh, and how do they like it? Thanks in advance!
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Using the Phantom style seat
Using the Phantom style seat mesh on the P-38 may not be possible any longer.
First off the Phantom seat mesh does not fit the P-38 seats properly,the mesh is about 2" too long and that places the pad too far forward. Becky had this problem and pictures of her bike showed exactly the same issue I had.
My question is why not use a small/med Phantom seat mesh on the Large P-38 seat? Seems like that would solve the "too long" problem.
That may not be possible though because Tim has changed the seat design on both the 2010 P-38 and Phantom and the seat mesh for these seats will not work on the older seats.
I'm not sure if he's still making the pre -2010 Phantom seat mesh we're talking about.
Before I was aware he had changed the seat design, I asked Tim if the fit problem I experienced using the Phantom mesh on my P-38 had been corrected and he told me the Phantom mesh will not longer work on older model bikes.
Tim needs to address the fit issue and post some info about what will fit what ,it gets very confusing and his one or 2 word email answers leave something to be desired.
Ben
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new style Lightning seat mesh - tentative thumbs up
I finally put a new style Lightning seat mesh on one of my bikes about a month ago. I secured it with 75 lb. zip ties, and tightened them as much as I could without breaking the ties. Left the surplus length of zip tie hanging, and went riding a few times. I then re-tightened the zip ties and cut off the extra length.
The new style mesh makes it easier to initially get a higher tension on the lumbar support area, and seems to maintain the higher tension better than the older style. So I think it is an improvement. But that impression is based on just one month of rides. As always, time will tell.
Safe riding,
Joel Dickman
seat mesh
How is the positioning of the seat pad? Mine was about 1 or 2 inches to far forward and caused an issue with tailbone.
I was having a problem with sore tailbone that year,but that has passed.
I still think they were made with the pad pocket sewn too far forward. I have a pic somewhere of the seat that I sent to Tim.
Ben
no problem with mine
The pocket that the thin piece of foam is stuffed into is positioned correctly on my mesh. I assume Lightning will exchange the one you have for another that fits properly.
Safe riding,
Joel
I tried the Phantom mesh on
I tried the Phantom mesh on my P-38 and found the foam pocket was sewed on too far forward. This left a gap at rear of the seat base so that my tailbone was off the pad and very uncomfortable.
I was having some issues with tailbone soreness before the new mesh was installed ,but it made my problem worse.
Tim said some of the early seat mesh had the foam pocket sewed a little to far forward.
I went back to the original seat mesh. I did like the ease of installing and adjusting the new mesh and hope when I need a new one the problem is resolved.
Ben
New Lightning (Lace Up In Back) Seat Mesh - Anyone Tried It?
I do have a two-year old Phantom with the new seat mesh, and I've never had to tighten it. I did just purchase a new cord-style seat mesh for my P-38, and it never occurred to me to try the Phantom style, probably because it's a two-piece seat for the Voyager.
I sort of had a fun time lacing it up, and I've never really had a problem with the cords, but I do prefer the Phantom style.
P38 and Phantom seat lacing
I have both a fairly new Phantom and a P38 with each type of seat mesh mentioned. I did take a small amount of slack from the Phantom seat after a few months of riding. Probably due to initial stretch of the mesh. The P38 seat mesh I've tightened a couple times in 2 years and just replaced all the lacing last month due to several broken cords along the frame. Lacing the P38 was fairly easy and no problem at all, I purchased the new cord from Tim Brunner for $25.
I do like the Phantom mesh seat better than the P38, but I would guess it's a tad bit heavier, if you're trying to watch your weight as I am. I even think the Phantom seat has better lower back support.
I'm convinced that Lightning has the best seat in the industry as I've tried many of them. It truly is a lawn chair on wheels!
lacing
I just replaced mine with parachute cord. I bought a 300 ft roll of it from "cheaper than dirt". Very durable stuff with a multitude of uses.
---skin
2000 Stealth seat
I've had my Stealth for 9 years & recently have used plastic heavy gauge tie wraps instead of the lace. This works very nice as I believe there is more tension mow so no sagging at all.
I have broken the tie wraps after a large bump at speed but I carry a bag of extra wraps now & I'm happy with the total feel of the seat now. I weigh 190 lbs at 5'10" , if I wanted I could double up on the tie wraps for each eyelet but I don't need to for my size. Happy with the tighter feel - seems to give a little more spring in the seat. Overall I'm really surprised at how durable the seat has been after all those miles. Testament to the design of the seat ! Agree with scooter about the lawn chair & thats how I describe it to people who ask me how it feels - a lawn chair on wheels.
The new seats on the website
The new seats on the website really do not look much different. Tim claims "more aero" which is kind of silly for a seat this large!!! At $350 for a new seat, I am not sure it is worth the investment on a ten year old bike.
Getting positioned on this seat is a bear! I am fighting constant leg and foot numbness. I know that part of the issue is making sure the thighs do not touch the front of the seat. This in itself is a challenge.
I have been placing my Bacchetta foam pad on top of the mesh. This seems to resolve some of the issues, but I am still playing with angle of the seat. Truly a case of one seat does not please all!
But it does seem like the seats on these bikes have been a major source of complaints over the years. I wonder why Tim has not done a true redesign? Yes, I understand the seat is an integral part of the frame, but it seems there have been enough issues around the seat where someone as brillant as he is would think about a redesign.
TheBean
new style Lightning seat
I have not had a chance to use the new Lightning seat, so my impressions are just a WAG (wild-assed guess). Looking at pictures, I suspect the main motivation for the change was to make it easier for shorter-legged riders to get their feet planted firmly on the ground at stops.
The Lightning seat works very nicely when it is in a fairly upright position, but does not work so well when reclined more: some riders hit the backs of their lower thighs on the seat's front cross brace.
The only thing that some Lightning riders have repeatedly complained about over the years is the tendency for the mesh to get loose over time. If you are vigilant, and have Boy Scout knot tying skills, you can probably keep the thing drum-tight.
Becky Taylor has had a seat mesh stretching problem after riding in the rain. I remember experiencing something similar after doing a hundred mile ride and getting drenched in a thunderstorm. I think I had to re-lace the seat after finishing.
If you can get the new Phantom seat mesh to fit your bike's seat frame, I think it is an improvement over the older style mesh. Easier to get tight initially, and seems to stay tight with less hassle and tweaking.
Safe riding,
Joel