SearchNavigationUser login |
Feet going to sleepNOt many miles into riding my P-38, I started to have problems with my feet going to sleep. I tried custom Othotics from e-soles and they started an additional issue. Shoes are pleanty roomy. Not a problem on my upright or my preious recombent, a Haluzak. My hypothesis is it had a higher seat position relative to the cranks. Any thougts?? How about a mod that would alow me to raise the seat It has a higher seat position 3" or so?? Second, I found the USS option more relaxing--natural, although probably has greater wind resistence.
|
Sleepy feet on P-38
Hello Kit,
I remember having a similar problem years back while riding a Vision recumbent. Every so often I would remind myself to wiggle my toes while riding, and that helped some.
The standard advice with circulation problems is to make sure your shoes are not laced too tight, because feet ordinarily swell during a ride. But you seem to have already made sure your shoes are roomy enough.
Would raising the seat height relative to the crankset help? You could experiment by obtaining a Thermarest inflatable cushion and putting it under your butt. Try different inflation pressures. Some people like these cushions, whether they have foot problems or not. You could probably raise your butt up an inch or so with the cushion fully inflated.
Experimenting with crankset boom extension might be helpful too.
I do not think trying to adapt underseat steering to the P-38 is a good idea. Yes, this style of steering is very relaxing, with your arms just hanging down at your sides. But it makes you catch more wind and slows you down, as you point out.
Let us know what you try doing, and what (if anything) helps.
Safe riding,
Joel Dickman
conditioning
years ago, when I first got 'bent so to speak, I experienced this too. But as I was just coming off a long spell of being a wedgie rider I understood that most discomfort issues could be solved by conditioning... I supposed that the problem was caused either having my feet up higher than my butt or by dehydration (as it only occurred after I had been cycling a while). So now I try to spend a couple hours a day hydrating with my feet elevated higher than my butt - It's a big sacrifice but one I'm willing to make, at least two hours every day with at least two pillows under my feet, in a lazyboy with plenty of cold beer. Of course the follow up is to keep hydrating while you ride too.
You might try fiddling with your cleat position, maybe moving them further away from your toes... But I really think that you want to raise your butt or lower your crank. A pad seems like a cheap and easy thing to try. Maybe instead of a short, chair style therma-rest you get a longer one, what they call 3/4 length, and fold it several thicknesses to gain more elevation?
Feet Going to Sleep
Joel, Thanks for the quick ideas. I totally over looked the simple solution of a seat cushion, and got lost in the complexity of custom seat back supports and machine aluminum blocks....etc... Iam not sure what Thermrest is or where to look for same, anyway. Thanks.
A longer boom, position seems to help. Today on a loop of 33 miles and a couple of good hills, the Problem developed after 2 hours... instead of with in 1. At the same time though using higher RPM's--which I think is also a positive. Last uncliping one foot and holding it straight but lower than the crank set while pedaling with one leg is a temporary remedy. Longer Cranks--fulcum stays the same, but longer lever should also reduce pressure...this ride has 172.5's from the factory...what do you think about going to 175's??
Under seat steering is still of interest. Race accross America at 60, or even keeping up with the young hot shots on a century or charity ride is not on my horizon. I believe what you say is correct, Iam still very interested in USS. Haluzak's USS is the only one I have tried. I would need a pivot point under the seat for the bars, a control arm to a tab attached on the forks. Adaptaion... not heresy!!!
Yours, Kit
Hot foot/sleepy foot problem
What brand of bike shoes are you using? I am assuming you are using spd cleats, and what brand pedals are you using. I think the stiffer the sole you use, the less problem you may have.
I tried the Specialized brand insert for my Shimano shoes, which has a metatarsal bump in it to help avoid irritating the nerve, and I noticed improvement. I would get some foot numbness after 40 miles before, and the inserts helped me get to 80 miles without numbness. I need to replace the insert, cause the metatarsal bump has been flattened out. I could really tell the difference when the inserts were new.
I would like to get a pair of Specialized shoes next, as I think they would have an even stronger metatarsal bump.
I use the Campus pedal, which has an spd cleat on one side and the other side does not have a cleat. So I can unclip one foot, and continue to pedal, but I move my foot up on the pedal so the arch of my foot is pressing on the pedal. This will provide some relief for a few miles, and reminds me to pedal in circles, and to unclip while coasting down hill so the pressure is completely relieved.
The best solution is to stop every 20 miles and walk around...
KJLeibold
Waterloo, IA
F-40 since 2001.
Vison R-84 tandem since 2000.
WizWheelz Sport, flaming orange, since 2007. Plus a few DFs, Mtn, & 1960s classics.
more on sleepy feet
1)Go to Google Shopping and type in "cascade designs therm a rest sport seat". I found an inflatable cushion that goes for $15 plus shipping, and would fit the P-38 seat bottom. Might help raise you up a bit. If you need a bigger boost in seat height, you will need to get creative with seat mounting adapters, or get a custom high seat from Lightning. Steve Delaire at Rotator recumbents could also do this, but it won't be cheap.
2) More experimentation with crankset boom length and trying different cycling shoes is worthwhile.
3) The trend with recumbent riders is to try shorter cranksets rather than long ones, but there is controversy about this. Warren Beauchamp recently created a recumbent crank length calculator at the www.wisil.recumbents.com website. When I enter my information in the calculator, the suggested crankset is too short for me. Mark Stonich can shorten many cranksets for reasonable cost. Visit his site at www.bikesmithdesign.com.
If you find longer cranksets work better for you, they should not be too hard to find.
4) Some recumbent riders like to position the cleats on their shoes closer to the heel than is the norm for upright riders.
5) If you are very fond of BOTH the P-38 bike and underseat steering, there is no heresy involved in changing the steering. But unless you have good fabricating skills, it could get pretty expensive to do this. I have never heard of anyone doing this before. You might be the first.
I think Tim Brummer tried building a P-38 prototype equipped with both above seat and below seat steering when he was first designing the bike long ago. So it is possible.
Alternatively, just ride a Haluzak, a Longbikes Eliminator, an older Vision, or some other bike that is already designed this way. I had a Ryan Vanguard bike many years ago that I enjoyed very much, and it had underseat steering. Not as fast and nimble as the Lightning, but a great machine in its own way.
Good luck, and don't give up on the P-38 prematurely,
Joel Dickman